Green Gas Grenades Request approval/Discussions

[b.samriey]

I hope, he isn't using any grenades (in NL) . Because you will be violating the law. Even if you have them in possession, You are violating the rules. They are not allowed within the Dutch borders in any ways.
Not the shotgun shells, neither are the explosives / powder shells like ICS has.

Edit: Having the launchers for the coolness is allowed thou

@b.samriey they are illegal because they look like explosives/grenades

Why on earth just in the Netherlands the Green Gas Grenades not allowed in Airsoft gameplay, who would believe this...!! may i know why?!! i can't find any reason prevents using such thing? the FPS..? most Green Gas Grenades lower than 330 FPS, the range barely 10 meters that if you can feel it when you got hit of this range.
Looks like real one? definitely no... So why and where to apply for approval please?

 

[Guest]

This mean the RPG7 is not allowed too?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HbQeivcHtj0

 

[Guest]

And yet the reason is that they look like real explosives, what might bring more chaos in a crowd, then a BB-gun does Just like the flashbangs, it doenst matter if they are pink and look like a soda can. They are forbitten to have!

 

[Guest]

Dear @Eviltwin-NL this thing drive me to be crazy right now, all our airsoft guns looks completely realistic, so they allowed to carry heavy machine gun to airsoft field but they don't allow you to own Green Gas Grenades smaller than Coca Cola can..!! they must be kidding me..
I am going to jump from my apartment like this guy at the end hahaha.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYHmqG5KWtY

 

[Guest]

However i think if we make poll (the airsoft community) and ask the nabv.nl to allow it they will listen to us.
But first we need to talk to Jan and then we start our appeal..
Any idea or suggestion please let me know.

 

[Guest]

The NABV is already trying to get us dutchies permission to use grenades (40mm get priority, but there goal is all airsoft grenades that aren't pyro). They are doing this through several means but as always, working with the goverment is slow, so dont expect any results very soon.

The reason they aren't allowed is that they indeed look to much like explosives. They fall in a different category of the law then our airsoft replica's, which are, in law, still illegal.

The reason why our legaslators aren't allowing grenades is that they have the opinion that they aren't crucial to the sport.

 

[Guest]

oh and in the case of the rpg-7 (and other launchers). These are a grey area as the airsoft versions are made to shoot bb's and thus should be allowed to be owned when you have a NABV pass. However some people in the justice department do not agree with that.

One thing is certain though: the grenade that sits on the rpg is illegal.

 

[Guest]

-Ok sound is good but if we still waiting for them, then we go to bejaardentehuis and the approval has not yet made it...
-The second thing "personally" i don't see any similarity between the actual grenades and the airsoft one, with all of that you can see the picture below and judge.
-Conversely, the airsoft grenades launcher play a big role with those who lying on the ground between the scrubland (and i need to use it for this purpose)..
For example: in last time our team squad got ambushed by someone who was lying on the ground and took us one after another, because there was no way to find him out. Each one got hit and (he or she) call hit and move back and me and my team move one step forward to check out where is that guy hiding and subsequently i discover he is lying on the ground but after too late and i got hit as well.. But if i had grenades launcher then it would be more easy to clear that path with one shot.
However thank you for valuable information you edit her man..

 

[Guest]

Well although the colors might give it away when you put it in a M203 or GP-25 launcher it doesn't matter as you are not able to see the stuff at that moment. I would love the gas grenades to become legal too as it would add such a important chokepoint clearing tool too an airsofter its arsenal.

 

[Guest]

See where this dude was camping, he sent whole team squad to the respawn area..

 

[Guest]

I know what you mean concerning the looks of the shells, but sadly there are a few shells available that do look exactly like a real 40 mm grenade, king arms and G&P have a few models. So the "looks argument" sadly can't be used.

Furthermore, the Dutch goverment doesn't see skirmishing as a sport, it's just a by-product. For the goverment IAPS is the airsoft sport, and you don't need (40mm) grenades for that.

 

[Guest]

Ok my man, a few years a go the Airsoft Sport was entirely not allowed in the Netherlands but with unremitting efforts by some good people they bring it to the real, so The Freedom Isn't Given It's Taken we have to ask and explain and deliver our voice to the responsible people to allowed this necessary item in Airsoft world, I wish if could know which department in charge who have the authority to allow the 40mm GG Grenades, then i will not hesitate to contact them from tomorrow morning! (keep wishing will not bring riches) so we have to work hard to bring it to the real.
Picture below to Airsoft 40mm grenade shell which is absolutely there is no actual one looks like it, so this one might be allowed..

 

[Guest]

Ok my man, a few years a go the Airsoft Sport was entirely not allowed in the Netherlands but with unremitting efforts by some good people they bring it to the real, so The Freedom Isn't Given It's Taken we have to ask and explain and deliver our voice to the responsible people to allowed this necessary item in Airsoft world, I wish if could know which department in charge who have the authority to allow the 40mm GG Grenades, then i will not hesitate to contact them from tomorrow morning! (keep wishing will not bring riches) so we have to work hard to bring it to the real.
Picture below to Airsoft 40mm grenade shell which is absolutely there is no actual one looks like it, so this one might be allowed..

The problem is that this looks like a real one though and that is where the problem lies as these should then also become legal at the same time as they want to exempt the whole explosives law for airsoft grenades. If I am correct in this.

 

[Guest]

The problem with allowing some grenades while still banning others is that it's proven that their will still be people who can't (or do not want) to read the rules properly. This will result in people doing stuff that isn't allowed. (Not just Dutch people luckily) If you allow people to purchase this:

there will be still people who buy this:

Looks the same without it's outer shell, but very real with

 

[Guest]

Ok, at the end i got some free time to upload my video which is explain enough how the grenades launcher is very important item in Airsoft gameplay, so feel free to check it out.

The problem with allowing some grenades while still banning others is that it's proven that their will still be people who can't (or do not want) to read the rules properly. This will result in people doing stuff that isn't allowed. (Not just Dutch people luckily) If you allow people to purchase this:

I do agree with you in this point, but still the (skirmish/Field) Marshall responsibility to inform the players on how to use it responsibly before they enter the game.
My experience with RSL skirm, they're always warn people not to shot on face area and no shooting less than five meters and many other safety lecture before we start the game.

Looks the same without it's outer shell, but very real with

The outer shell is dust cover and most brand they don't offer it for free or include your purchase, however they can prevent the outer shell it's not really necessary in general accessories no more that..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z8fCDWxtev8

 

[Guest]

I do agree with you in this point, but still the (skirmish/Field) Marshall responsibility to inform the players on how to use it responsibly before they enter the game.

In my view, this is not a responsibility to put down on a Marshall or field. Fields don't have to tell you how to use your Airsoft replica, do they? You should be 100% familiar with your gear, including replica, ammo, you name it. You can't blame a Marshall when a player shoots someone in the face. Same with nades; they're not responsible for how others would use them.

 

[Guest]

In my view, this is not a responsibility to put down on a Marshall or field. Fields don't have to tell you how to use your Airsoft replica, do they? You should be 100% familiar with your gear, including replica, ammo, you name it. You can't blame a Marshall when a player shoots someone in the face. Same with nades; they're not responsible for how others would use them.

Dear @Stey i think you misunderstand my point...
It's not about Marshall must telling me or any another player on how to use an Airsoft gun, it's all about safety matter which it should be always briefed by Marshalls at any airsoft field before starting the game, whether reminding the regular players or new ones. So i believe this is positive thing and we have all to agree with it..
However regarding to the injuries or damage during the match (maybe you were refers to) the Marshall has nothing to do with it and there is no one can blame him at all.
Therefore in other words:-
- Marshalls briefing the player about safety matter and playing responsibly before starting the game:-
We will witness less injuries incident and fine gameplay.
- Marshalls didn't brief the player about safety matter or playing responsibly before starting the game:-
We may witness some injuries incident during the game and that's what everyone does not want to see..
You got me buddy?

 

[Guest]

I got you, mate... BUT:

Marshalls and fields are already obligated to perform a routine introduction and safety procedure as required by the NABV. The core of the introduction and safety procedure will always be the same, eventhough one field will have a different emergency protocol than another. So, in a way you're requesting/demanding what every field is already obligated to do? Once grenades are legal, these will most likely be included in introduction with its own guidelines (no nades within __ meters).

 

[Guest]

First of all, thanks to all the participants in this discussion. Its a healthy discussion without anyone getting upset or gnawing at each other ^_^

I understand your frustration Samriey. In CQB situations its also a welcomed tool. Toss a nade around a corner and you can clear it without losing the first man to a "PANG".

One of the reasons grenades are illegal according to the NABV, is that they pose a threat just by lying on the ground. Police are not taking any risks when they find something that looks like an explosive.

When someone leaves a M16/AK replica lying around, Police picks it up. But a device that has resemblance to an explosive, is a whole different story. EOD (Explosive ordnance unit) needs to come in and investigate.

With all the home made explosives that are going around Europe, I can imagine even something that is not an exact replica of a 40mm grenade gets the same treatment. As long as it is a cilinder and has a fire pin, EOD gets called in I imagine.

 

[Guest]

Another thing I'm wondering @Jan ; blindfiring isn't allowed... but you can just toss a grenade around the corner (without looking?) 'n see what happens? I pitty the fool that kept his mouth shut , just 1m away from your angle